Project Umbrella Podcast Thread

Cheers for the comments guys. Feel free to discuss anything and don't be shy to send us an mp3 with your thoughts and questions. As well as Bio 6 we will also be discussing the Damnation reveals at comic on so there will be plenty to talk about.

Well I don't have much about every one or anything, just an occassional thought about a couple I've listened to so far... I'll write it up because calling in with this might be out of context for being about much earlier casts.

When it comes to Podcast 01 about Resident Evil... someone (and I'm sorry, I'll do this a lot because after listening to so many in a row I can't always remember who said what) about the risks involved in originally releasing the game.  This was a great point I really wanted to focus on.

Most people say the early "tank" controls are bad, general critical comment has been reasonably negative since early in the franchise and more so as it went on... but it can't be any earlier than within the games own development. Yoshiki Okamoto was highly negative about the game he was involved in overseeing throughout the development... and the controls were always one of his biggest problems. The other issue was due to the save system, he actually inferred via interviews the whole games point was hunting "Ink Ribbon's" and hated the idea of the save system.

You don't have to take my word for it, here's a roughly translated interview archive originally published in "Research on Biohazard 2 Final Edition" which discusses it.

http://survivhor.biohazardfrance.net/morbidcreations/re_behind/re_int.ht...

Seeing how harsh he is about it, I'm surprised sometimes the game even made it out at all. If someone has a more properly translated version I'd love to read it or anything else. I know this isn't the only time he talked about it.

Going there also reminded me you guys touched on Dash, and mentioned the info (which came from Genki PlayStation in late 1996). Someone said it was The Last Escape that had it in French, but it was SurvivHor (although still part of Biohazard France).

http://survivhor.biohazardfrance.net/RE_DASH/

But there was also mentions of surprise that the Training Facility had been planned so early. I don't think it's too surprising, I figure from what I pieced together several years back around the time Zero actually came out a lot of it's own scenario does go all the way back to Dash.

I have a magazine (I think maybe Next Gen) away in a box somewhere I really should try and find from early 1997 which had a lengthy Capcom preview, mostly based on the fact RE was coming to Saturn shortly after. But in it is another interview with Okamoto I believe, but it discusses in passing two game ideas for the future he mentions, one a prequel or sequel to the original game now intended for the N64 and a "samuari" game based on the RE engine. Of course the former became Zero and the later became Onimusha (which of course was originally due for the PS1).

I jump to conclusions on this of course, and would love to know if I'm correct, but I assume Dash became the N64 title, which then was reworked post RE2 into the N64 Zero, and then into the GC version. Of course without asking people involved with the development all the way back then I'm unsure and I could be completely wrong. I don't know if any of this is interesting, but just wanted to bring it up.

When you all talked about the impact of RE in it's release and simular titles and time frame, RE was different in a lot of ways but I, and saying this as a massive fan of the original title no question, actually found quite comfortable paralells to PC adventure games from the early 90's when it came out in 1996.

And I figure most of you didn't play those or played the original not in 1996 but maybe in the years after... and so while very influential and successful as a console product which in the past 18 months had just seemingly leaped years ahead (in graphics and sound especially), if you'd played adventure games on a PC it wasn't as massive a leap. I mean I can simply mention "Alone In The Dark" and you have the pre-rendered background things, but it's not just about that - it's that idea of moving a character around in that enviroment avoiding/killing enemies and solving puzzles.

Sweet Home, which is often noted in the source notes by the devs, is also part of a glut of games in the 80's that seemingly played on haunted house/zombie titles across all sorts of formats. Even that upcoming Wii-U game Zombi-U is based on Ubisoft's Zombi title from the late 80's which has a simular system. A mixture of pick a path and adventure puzzle. Hell the first ever game I played was a game called Transylvania on the Apple Mac, right in that grouping.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transylvania_%28series%29

I just thought these may have been worthwhile touchstones, but then again they may have been a little too deep for general discussion. I mean look how much I've written here, it's almost rant sized.

In podcast number 3 I'm glad discussion on ORC talked about the money making bigger number focus and the idea of there being some point of researching existing canon (even if they did fuck the execution up of how they made the final product that their work could never be part of it).

Additionally if anything should be taken away and reused it is the prized difference of the three way competition with Human Vs. Human Vs. Undead/BOW. And of course as many mentioned, done properly the game could have succeeded far better around this core idea.

One thing surprisingly no one noted... well kinda pushed the edge of... was that the game of course wasn't friendly for long time fans due to that treatment, but was focused for new comers... This was said of course, but no one thought about this from the other way around.

If you put a new player fresh to franchise into ORC they're going to not give a rats ass about the "story" because there enough unexplained elements that won't make any sense. Mostly because no setup is given to even the characters new to this game, nor anyone who comes from others.

Look at the start of the game... who are the team, whats the outbreak all about, what's the importance of this Birkin guy really, or HUNK... and this very simple lack of information continues frequently throughout the game. The simple failure no one ever mentioned that helped, especially the campaign to fail, was just simply a pure lack of traditional story telling.

Without that you can't please old fans, but you can't engross newcomers to give a rats ass either. Then it really does become a bland shooter because all you have is (shit) gameplay.

I'm sorry if this is a lot of text, I just actually really enjoyed listening to the discussions. I'll try not to bombard everyone with another massive wall when I listen to the next 3 podcasts. Thanks again!

I'd love to be on the defence side for Resident Evil 5, much to the horror of some of you, am writing a feature at the minute for the site I work on which I'll have to link.

Look forward to it, Ty!

I remember when I first got into Resident Evil in 1997 and my friends and I loved it, yet I was the only one who really felt the tank controls to be completely comfortable. So much so in fact that the others actually preferred to just watch me play the game rather than go through it themselves. I remember so many people loving the idea of the game and being seduced by the graphics back in the day but were just completely put off by the controls. But I can't really see what alternative control system you could have in that particular format the early games had.

And Mr Okamoto's comments about the ink ribbons must be a Japanese thing, given how they like the easiness of their games and their 'training' modes. I don't think many of us would have grumbled too much had the ink ribbons only been found in singles rather than packs of three. But it seems another sign of the times that that save system has slowly been abadnoned altogether from ink ribbons, to just typewriters and now just plain old auto-save. 

I'm not sure if Bio Dash ever made it past the concept stage but it was a playstation title and was scrapped in 1997 so I don't think it could have evolved into what we eventually got in Bio 0. I think once the main sequel's focus was the infection of all of Raccoon City the idea was just binned. But I'm guessing there.

And as for Op Raccoon, our opinions on that game were overshadowed by the fact that Slant Six and Capcom to an extent played the 'canon' card right up until the death to try and attract the old school fans. I think it was only about a month from release when Kawata finally came out and admitted publicly that it was a 'what-if' scenario. Had they done that from the start I think the old-school fans would have been a lot more accepting of the title, warts and all. 

The game as a whole was just incredibly lazy. There is practically no story whatsoever. 

You should join us for an episode Rob.

And Ty, I plan on fully defending Resident Evil 5. Should be a fun debate as I know GT hates it. 

Listened last night to Podcast 04 about Dead Aim... but I just wanted to say thanks for mentioning Marco Cavagna. No offense to STARS_Tyrant because I enjoy his writing but Marco's timeline was one of originals back in the day and the first I can remember to cite sources, note canon and non-canon items, and make lists of releated content (facilities, characters, enemies, etc). Basically a pre-cursor to wiki styled projects. 

He started that in the later part of 2000 and was keeping it up to date until around the time REmake and Zero came out. Problem was Marco was training to be a Doctor and so he just wasn't around online as much and then I eventually never saw him again. He had the file up at Dark Legacy, which is where most of the PC RE1/2 modding started, then put it up on GameFAQ's later... but eventually took it down when it got too out of date. The only copy I can find is on an angelfire website should anyone want to see it.

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/darkreflection/timeline.txt

Before Marco's Chronology there was only ever two documents I was aware close to this. One was President Evil's Plot Analysis, which became Thomas Wilde's when he took it over a couple of years later after PE (Dan Birlew) went off writing offical strategy guides, and one earlier timeline which was first started in late 1998 (coving just the two titles in the franchise at first) and discontinued in early 2000, written by.... me. Because how crap it stood up against the weight of new games coming out (which ironically was why I started it), combined with the fast paced success of New Blood and RESitez, I discountinued it and managed to wipe it from the face of the internet, baring old newsgroup posts archived forever by Google, one mention on IGN (my own fault), and the mention in Marco's timeline above.

I very much agree with what was mentioned by STARS_Tyrant about it earlier works though, the resources just weren't around to actually be able to check a whole lot and you had to either take things on a lot of blind faith or hope that it was seemingly so obvious that it was or wasn't part of the ongoing fiction. Something that makes this place very different than anything else done before in a lot of ways.

Oh, I missed that there was a reply posted when I was writing up my thing about the timeline. Sorry about the double post.

I totally agree on a personal basis of the controls, I really never had issues with the "tank" controls either and in the early days when I was online there wasn't a lot of complaints to be honest. I don't think that really started until Code Veronica arrived and people kinda started questioning why a game that had gone to a new console generation still controlled the same. Of course a lot of the first complaints came in the form of the reviews done I think, and as more control options opened up on other games that just continued to expand more and more.

Yeah, the 1.5 story of infection was started via the mansions explosion wasn't it? But I wasn't specifically meaning Dash itself entirely changed into the N64 game and/or then version of Zero, but more that some of the elements that had been thoughtout for it, such as the training facility and the like, went into the ideas which would eventually become Zero on the N64 and then later on the Cube. I say this mostly due to the fact we know Capcom recycle unused stuff a hell of a lot and thats not something new and given the comment about the facility being mentioned so early, it wouldn't have surprised me one bit had it and other elements of Zero go all the way back to Dash.

I think it was said in the cast, but ORC smacks of at once trying to use established events and characters and trying to build it into the canon but then the conflict of changing stuff so much it was never going to work. I know the die hard fans would have been happy if the what if scenario card had put out there early or from the start, but I think the reason it took so long to do so was simply because of that in-game clash of what is connected and what isn't. As if it was point they had thought they were doing the right thing. I don't know, again I'm just taking a guess, but it would explain the content in the game I guess.

If you guys have a topic you want me on, I'm happy to join you for an episode sometime. Let me know. Otherwise I'm enjoying hearing all of your thoughts on the various parts of the franchise very much. 

It's nice to know I have brothers in arms for this, I'll try to do my biggest call for this podcast.

It's war now.

Sounds good, I sit a bit on the fence wit RE5, like the story, but didn't like the game too much.

I liked the game and story for what it was. I could go on and on but I'll keep it at that for now. Also where do we send the mp3 if we were to make one?

So I listened to the Resident Evil 4 cast last night, and had a good trip down memory lane for most of it. Smiley was a great guest, not saying that others haven't been, but seeing as you'd originally expected the internet might blow up with NB and him on the same event it actually was very casual and everyone was allowed to say their piece. Nice stuff.

I had a great laugh at the discussion on the fixed Ashley camera angles in the Japanese version, when everyone found out they exist only in that version - the uniformed "Ahhhhhh!" was great.

My only real point of discussion is the early early days which most of you don't know much about as far as order or progress and online went. The range of 1997-2005 was kinda my 'always in the know range', so maybe this will help decyper some of the order of things.

Firstly Biohazard 4 was first unofficially announced in 1999  mostly because media were pressing Capcom late in the year for future games and plans for next gen consoles, and discussion always pointed to continuation of the main story franchise on the PS2 as well as looking into the future of network gaming (which eventually lead to Outbreak). Why at this time is odd because there was already a massive amount of product due in 2000. But in any case the focus was a sequel would be due on the PS2 sometime after it launches and the expectation was by years end 2001 we'd be seeing another game.

The TGS in late 99 was Biohazard overload. There was Bio 3, which had just been released in Japan that month, Gun Survivor was announced, plus showcasing of Code Veronica, Zero N64, Bio2 on the N64 and Dreamcast. Crazy amount of stuff for one show anyway.

Of course all of this released over the following several months, barring Zero, and then Zero appeared again at the 2000 E3 but nothing else. At this point release info had been fairly clockwork for all of the history in the franchise (even when 1.5 got changed into 2, it happened quickly enough we knew what was happening) so the fact nothing appeared at it of 4 started to worry some in the community. This was only made worse when very shortly after the E3 it was rumored Zero was being canned and moved to the next Nintendo console, which eventually was confirmed by Capcom as well. Later in the year around October I think, maybe as late as November, Capcom announced online a new title which was of course Devil May Cry.

http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/xgv5wf/devil-may-cry-devil-may-cry-fi...

Straight away it was announced that this had started as 4 and had spun off, but Capcom also reconfirmed work on 4 was going ahead - which if I recall was actually, and ironically, the first time an official confirmation took place the game was even happening.

2001 came and went with very little big news. We had the 5th Anniversary set (which had that space for a PS2 Bio4) and CVX with the DMC demo, but after that early part of the year the the later part was horrible. The Gamers Day early in the year reconfirmed the PS2 was the focus. In March or April Mikami was in an interview with the OUKPS2 mag saying Hunk was likely going to be a focus (does this tie into the Hunk game idea NB?) But then went quiet.

In September, Capcom announced all of the GC titles (Remake, Zero, and now 4) along with ports of RE2, 3, and CVX. They were the focus for all of 2002 along with Network Biohazard and Dead Aim announcments coming during in the year. That was until the Capcom 5 announcement in November of 2002, when the first vision of 4 was shown.

People forget it took that long for that first footage to actually arrive, honestly often in topics I see people saying about the footage being much earlier but it wasn't - that time was the earliest we saw it. It took almost 3 years for that footage and people were estatic just to see anything. The announcement happened alongside P.N.03, Viewtiful Joe, Killer7, and the never released Dead Pheonix.

Onimusha was, as mentioned in my earlier post and as mentioned by NB on the cast itself, planned all the way back in 97. The PlayStation Museum has footage up from one of Capcom's old demo reels. If you played the PS2 version then you can see the design and backgrounds aren't different, just lower resoultion and the character models are PS standard. My understanding was it was mostly completed before being moved to the PS2, but double checking now the internet tells me only 50-60% of the game was done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvOFYZ5Cm2I

Onimusha on the PS2 was the console's first big seller when it released in Jan 2001 in Japan, it moved over a million copies in it's first weekend which was entirely unexpected when the price of the PS2 console in Japan was rediciously high.

Also as mentioned about the Gun Survivor outsourcing, I think that was mentioned when the game was announced, I mean it recycled elements from Bio 2 obviously which should be a clue to the quality rushing out. But also that at the time Capcom had several projects ongoing (as mentioned above at the TGS in late 99). I'm sure I remember a company being labelled at the time for it, but I never confirmed if it was correct. The thing about Flagship's scenario is the reason for it's mention in Zero as well, because obviously they were happy with the story in GS and added it into their Zero script.

As for the finished 4, I mostly agreed with the comments about the underwelming announcement that Umbrella was gone in the 2 minute opening scene (which I knew about well in advance of actually playing the game because the gaming media online latched onto that quite early), but I enjoyed the gameplay mechanics. 4 was the first game I imported to play immediately on overseas release, prior to that I'd either waited for local versions or at least the UK version to come out, and only purchased US and JPN releases well after the game had come out. But over time the game has sat better with me, mostly due to 5 like most of you as well.

Anyway, going to stop rambling. I've almost caught up... looking forward to the Biohazard 2 one.

Podcast 7 should be up on the site very soon. A short and sweet edition focusing on the demo of RE6.

Can't wait.

I am sorry I didn't get to throw in some questions or talk about my points of view. I am in the process of getting a new job so it has taken my time. Can't wait to hear it though and hope to contribute to the next one!

Good timing, just finished up episode six yesterday due to lack of time last week. You guys nailed the coverage as far as I was concerned, giving enough cover of the pre-release history and the final product. Massive, massive nostelgic buzz. Also much kudos for the discussion on the bioweapon medley and then putting it into the edit at the end. Made me want to crack out the game and play it right there and then. Awesome.

"Someone hasn't played the demo." 

Exactly the reaction I wanted, haha. Nice podcast guys, short but sweet. 

Yeah, good questions Vito since it was related to RE6 haha. But always fun to listen guys. Found myself trying to address some of George's question/concerns through my comp while cooking! So thanks for making a podcast that had me immersed. And Ark Thompson, mark my words haha.

In case anyone's missed it Episode 7 is now available to download here:

http://projectumbrella.net/podcast/Episode%207.mp3

All on biohazard 6 demo and Damnation trailer etc. Quite a short podcast this time around. I particually like the cameo from legendary guitar player, Slash at the end.

I need to improve on the quiz. I seem to be in a mid-season slump.

For the purposes of the other participants, it's better that you don't lol want the others to catch up lol!

Just managed to catch up on the last podcast, short and sweet as stated. Good stuff. Looking forward to the next.

I also just wanted to come back and correct my earlier statement about the "Resident Evil with Samurai" comment, was Okamoto in 1997 and it was "Resident Evil with Ninja's" - interestingly I found a scan of the article over at Biohaze that Yama had posted.

http://www.biohaze.com/specials/re15articles/7.jpg

Wow, that is extremely interesting, the failed 64DD, a ninja RE.  Sounds like a spin off more than anything. FYI, Episode 8 was recorded last night. Editing will be starting soon, and there is a lot of this time, all thanks to Mr Spencer! Episode 8 is an OLYMPIC SPECIAL that also covers Darkside Chronicles so should be online before the closing ceremony at least, lol.

The possibility of what it was at first is unsure, but I am 90% sure this idea became Onimusha and probably due to the DD/size issue. Timing is right, it started in mid 1997 using the 1.5 engine in the RE style. Capcoms subtlety isn't exactly known when these sorts of statements and then you get something like that. But we will never know for sure without unless there is some making of material untranslated or asking Okamoto, Inafune, Takeuchi or any other major person involved. 

http://projectumbrella.net/podcast/Episode%208.mp3

Episode 8 the olympics special aka Darkside Chronicles is now available to download. Special guest, the lovely Sindra!

Wow, I'm lagging due to a busy schedule at the minute, still need to listen to Episode 7!

Obligatory ass reference.

Now legendary.

I'm lucky enough to some free time in the afternoon's to listen to the podcast the day it comes out. Great Work on this one guys!

There's just something I want to bring up: In podcast number 5 (re4) Question 4 in the quiz was, Sherry was born in 1986 who else was. Batman answered Sheva and Manuela, Mr. Spenser and Smiley also answered Mauela. They both got a point but according to the Chronology of Evil Manuela was born in 1987 meaning both Mr. Spenser and Smiley were wrong. Does this mean they will get a point deduction. If so now Mr.Spenser is on I think 21 1/5 and Smiley is on 2 for the "Star in the reasonably priced quiz". Hopefully someone form the podcast reads this and it gets sorted out. I always root for an underdog so: GO GEORGE TREVOR! you are now gloser to victory.

And is there anyway in can do a question for the quiz, I think I've got a good one (maybe).

L.Veltro

P.S Sindra I also generally also buy games even if I don't have the console. I have RE5 gold edition for PS3 and am thinking of pre-ordering RE6. Now I only need to get a PS3 (sigh) And thanks for getting me hooked on Castlevania by the way After listening to podcast number 8 I downloaded the 3 Castlevania games for Visual Boy Advance.... FUCKING AWESOME!!! 

Small mistake on the timeline in that case. Manuela was indeed born in 1986 as she was five years old when her mother had cancer in 1991 so no points deduction needed.

Oh okay! Thanks Batman :) 

I still wan't to a question for the podcast though!. It'll be nothing like some of Vito's questions (I did get the one abput the bottle-caps though)

L.Veltro

Batman will not lose any more points ..... haha!!! No more suspect calls from The Founder!